Position of the adjective, traditional.

Question

I am searching for some pattern in the placement of an adjective when it modifies a noun also modified by a prepositional phrase.  Our paragraph has two examples where the adjective, traditional, modifies such a noun.  The first concerns "dinde rôtie aux marrons".  There were a number of possibilities given for the position of traditionnelle including directly in front of dinde.  The second usage is in the last sentence where traditionel modifies plats de Noël.   Following the example from the first usage, I placed traditionnels in front of plats thinking that plats de Noël should be kept together.  This was marked as incorrect and I see that traditionnels is placed in the customary position after the noun and in front of de Noël.   Is there rule that one can apply to the placement of adjectives when they modify a noun also modified by some sort of prepositional phrase such as plats de Noël or dinde rôtie aux marrons ?

Accepted Answer

There is a very slight nuance/difference in meaning whether the adjective  'traditionnel' is placed before or after the noun -

le traditionnel repas de Noël = the traditional ( good old/usual ) Christmas meal 
le repas traditionnel de Noël = the traditional Christmas meal ( with turkey, stuffing, trimmings  according to customs)

In the phrases

la traditionnelle dinde rôtie aux marrons 
la dinde rôtie aux marrons traditionnelle

The problem is because of the additional adjective 'rôtie' so the placing is either before 'dinde' or at the end of the phrase and the nuance is lost and unimportant in that context.
Normally it would sit better after the noun to mean 'according to customs'.
Hope this helps!

Answer

Hi Frank,Have a look here  --  it may help you.https://progress.lawlessfrench.com/my-languages/french/view/3002?rts=%252Fsearch%253Fs%253Dadjectives%252Bposition

Answer

I am also questioning the different placement of "traditionnel."  I read the link shared by Jim and it seems to be saying that the adjective belongs AFTER the noun modified by a prepositional phrase.  I think both of these sentences fit that rule so I remain confused.